We are joined this week by the author and historian Professor Joseph Ellis. He and Clay have an in-depth discussion about the Founding Fathers and their willing participation in the enslavement of people. Read about Clay's upcoming online courses here: https://jeffersonhour.com/onlinecourse Find this episode, along with recommended reading, on the blog. Support the show by joining the 1776 Club or by donating to the Thomas Jefferson Hour, Inc. You can learn more about Clay's cultural tours and retreats at jeffersonhour.com/tours. Check out our new merch. You can find Clay's publications on our website, along with a list of his favorite books on Jefferson, Lewis and Clark, and other topics. Thomas Jefferson is interpreted by Clay S. Jenkinson.