There’s a fair amount of research to support the notion that spirituality and religion can be awfully good for people (and for their kids). But organized religion doesn’t exactly have a spotless track record - no matter what faith you’re talking about. Plus Matt and Max both grew up pretty much full-on heathen, so even if they do buy into the benefits, is religion really something that they could genuinely incorporate into their families’ lives? The Boys welcome the refreshingly open-minded Dan Koch to the program to hash it out. Dan hosts the brilliant podcast You Have Permission. He was raised Evangelical, left it behind, and became a therapist and researcher (with a focus on spiritual trauma) - all while remaining a person of deep faith. Dan has spent much of his life thinking about the babies and bathwaters of spirituality and religion - and as a father, he spends a lot of time trying to figure out what that looks like for families and kids. How do we give our children access and exposure to the innate human drives for meaning, transcendence, and connection to something bigger than ourselves… without shoving a bunch of mumbo-jumbo down their throats? Let’s go!